Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby Cralis on Sun 25 Apr 2010 13:49

PracticalM wrote:And really I call bullshit on having 60 lines for 10 squadrons. In every 3rd edition game I've played with fighters, I only needed a line per squadron as well.


Never said that. I said "a full page of records."

You can simplify squadrons immensely by limiting weapons to being the same across an entire squadron, but often you had non-weapon components like jammers and stuff that needed to be mixed. While you can place a squadron on a written line (or half a line printed), for ULTRA I've put up to 5 squadrons on a single printed line.

Crucis, 60000 ft is still too close when your onboard weapons can shoot a hair over 246 million feet :lol:
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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby PracticalM on Sun 25 Apr 2010 14:52

Crucis wrote:
PracticalM wrote:And you are grossly over-simplifying as you have to find Squadrons with the same internal weapon and crew grade.


No. I was not!!!!

As with Matt, you are reading more into what I said than was there. Combining SQ's by DP is conceptually similar to combining SQ's by individual ftr or GB. That is entirely true when one is looking at it from the 60,000 foot level.


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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby Cralis on Sun 25 Apr 2010 17:51

Hey Guys, I think we are getting a little defensive here. Let's not get too aggressive...

I was simply answering a why question. The simply truth is that ULTRA's system does take a little less space then CLASSIC's system, and the focus is away from individual small craft. We don't really need to dig trenches and start a new Battle of the Ardennes over the issue.
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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby krenshala on Mon 26 Apr 2010 18:06

So, traditionally a GB squadron is 4 ships and fighters are 6. Got it.

I know, it doesn't quite work out if you use that as hard and fast numbers considering the DP values, but it at least gives an idea for people. Perhaps the tech appendix can include a line like: "A typical (GB|Fighter) squadron consists of (4|6) ships, though the actual numbers may vary by generation and even race."

Back on the topic when things drifted ... interpenetration of GB and/or fighter squadrons -- Couldn't the rule be that the squadron takes 15% of current DP in damage? A 15% chance of interpenetration or 15% DP off the top should lead to same amount of squadron losses. It would also avoid the problem of grouping GB/FQ with large units.
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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby PracticalM on Mon 26 Apr 2010 21:46

That would be interesting, but use the results of C4.04.2 instead of a straight 15%
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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby krenshala on Tue 27 Apr 2010 00:56

PracticalM wrote:That would be interesting, but use the results of C4.04.2 instead of a straight 15%

Ah, thats right. I'd read that rule just recently too, but had forgotten it. C4.04.2 to determine the percentage of DP done to each squadron would definitely be better than a straight 15%. ;)

Oh, and in case I wasn't being clear in my other post on this, I was suggesting it be based on the current DP of the squadron, not its full DP. This way a GB or FQ squadron all beat to hell would not take as much damage from the ST as there are fewer ships in it ... though it could make things worse if the DP value was low enough. :twisted:
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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby drakar on Thu 29 Apr 2010 18:25

Ok I don't play with fighters and gunboats very often but here is a question that we have had in my group that pertains to this section I believe. In previous editions small craft were unable to equip precision weapons until SL12 does this still hold true as I have seen nothing in Ultra's rules and we scrounged everywhere to look for it?
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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby drakar on Thu 29 Apr 2010 18:34

Also when i began to ponder upon it I began to realize that if one was to equip beam weapons to their small craft at the alpha gen they would mount an alpha gen beam weapon, now the concern here is that not a single alpha gen beam weapon can fire at a range of 9 hexes so why are the small craft versions of these alpha weapons able to? Maybe a pointless rant but I saw this and have become bent in discussion with my SM and we have come to a similar realization that this makes little to no sense. If someone could please enlighten me on this issue it would ease my mind as I am wondering if this is a large oversight...
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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby Cralis on Thu 29 Apr 2010 20:31

First, SRW only have a range of 9 for every basic weapon type against large units. If you look at the BASV table, you'll see that not every weapon type has a range of 9.

Second, SRW weapons generations are not the same as the original weapon generations. These are more like "small craft generations." To use the phrase, "pound for pound" an alpha generation SRW has more power and miniaturization then the equivalent "alpha generation" for large ship versions of the weapon. These are equivalent technology generational steps, not the actual generations from the original weapon.

In this case you are overlooking the fact that it is an equivalence. You are taking it too literally.

As for precision weapons, I don't know. I don't see it either. I'll find out.
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Re: Fighter SRW Weapons Example/Discussion:

Postby drakar on Thu 29 Apr 2010 20:47

Thank you that answered the question that had been bugging me. The precision weapons are just a side note as I had noticed it today as I was looking over the rules working on a new ship class design that incorporated small craft.
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